Completely new to GW, why is almost everyone W/x or M/x? - Guild Wars Forums

Antelope Salad · Jul 03, 2010, 03:23 PM // 15:23

I recently started to play GW and have been reading the various wiki sites for a while and just got to LA only to notice like 80% of the players are W/x or M/x.

Then I started to observe PvP matches and the trend was the same. Usually 2-3 warriors, 3-4 monks and whatever else to fill in the gaps.

Then I started to think about it and it kind of made sense but maybe I'm wrong because I don't know enough about the game.

The way I see it is like...

If you go M/x then you have the possibility of running any sub-class in PvE. This allows you to cater towards a lot of different situations, and you can also run a 55 variant of any sub-class for non-boss solo farming.

Since healing/etc. seems to always be in demand you're set for finding parties and in the end you can unlock stuff no problem in PvE.

In PvP you play the role of healer/buffer/wards/support/cleanser/etc.

If you go W/x then you can sub monk for a 55 build to quickly solo farm (I guess?), and in regular parties I'm sure there's a spot for a tank or someone who can make quick work of scattered trash mobs.

In PvP you're a primary damage dealer and in some cases crowd control.

It seems like the GW devs made a huge effort to have a complex and dynamic game but the player base is almost all the same. Why is this? Is it due to the current PvE/PvP metagame or are the other main classes just outmatched compared to W and M?

Since they are top tier in PvE and PvP then they seem like the only main character who can be made for PvE but also be used in PvP.

Chucky333 · Jul 03, 2010, 04:05 PM // 16:05

Warrior and Monk are staple characters in GW, that's just the way it is.
Unless it's a gimmick build, both are very common in PvE and the in the current PvP meta melee professions other than warrior (Assassin and Dervish) hardly see any use in organized PvP. Some gimmick builds use non-monk backline like Rits or E\Rt, N\Rt etc.
The rest of the characters are not just to fill the gap either. Midline is very important.
I'm not entirely sure i understand the question. If you're asking whether just some professions are used extensively and others are hardly used, then the answer is yes. Both in PvE and PvP.
Why? Balance issues and flawed design from Anet probably saw to that.

Smith23 · Jul 03, 2010, 04:06 PM // 16:06

Using M/x or W/x allows the player not to really have to think when it comes to combat. You will also see a lot of D/x or A/x for that same reason.

Also W/x or M/x is a favorite when it comes to bot characters.

FoxBat · Jul 03, 2010, 04:32 PM // 16:32

As far as PvE goes, W and Mo are only overly popular with newbies due to percieved survivability, which is all you are going to find in the outposts that aren't traders/botters. Experienced players are usually off in their own instances; many of them may be playing W and Mo which are fine classes, but that is far from making them either the strongest or most versatile PvE characters.

"Balanced" GW PvP is fundamentally about warriors vs monks with everyone else just for show, although that is less true these days with all the gimmicky caster DPS running amok in casual formats and GvG tiebreakers.

Fate Crusher · Jul 03, 2010, 04:38 PM // 16:38

Firstly, I can safely say everyone you see is capable of rolling on to a different character and play a different profession. Players have main characters they like to concentrate on title/expensive armour pieces and weapons in order to show off.
Warrior is a prime example because the armour types are very distinguished.

For PvE, especially in Hard Mode, frontliners in parties are preferred to have high armour otherwise they're a waste. Critical Agility for Assassins increase their base armour to 90, but a warrior with shield has 96, plus absorption and physical reduction. Personally, i think a MS/DB (Moebius Strike/Death Blossom) assassin provides so much more as a frontliner because of huge damage and 33% quicker attack speed.

Monks are preferred because of prots. Rits are great to utilise sometimes (combine Weapon of Fury with a Imbagon/warrior/sin), but just can't support a group as guaranteed as a monk.

PvP will be more difficult to explain.

Yes warriors are a primary source of damage. but blindly attacking everything without tactics isn't the key to success. Neither is the "a monk heals, so i attack that first" theory created by most 4v4 beginners. This is where the midline comes in.

Example, for defensive reasons, Guild A choose to run a Blinding Surge Ele to counter the melee damage. However, Guild B has a pro ranger. He is firstly capable of disrupting said ele and allow the melee to be free of blind and possibly weakness (also sucks). Now, Guild B uses their hammer war to keep the bsurge ele in a KD chain and also pressure with damage he can't kite, which also means effective AoE can be implemented (this is just an example. this tactic is normally used in HA). this puts pressure on monks because as a 2 monk backline, they are always better at healing/protting each other or themselves.

This is also the reason why interrupts or shutdowns (Mesmer or Ranger) are heavily preferred because they can be implemented defensively (said bsurge) or offensively, by shutting down/interrupting monks.

It also makes sense in 4v4 to pressure targets other than the monk if they have bonnetti's, which upon a melee attack, they gain energy. if you ignore them and drain their energy out without allowing them to regenerate, that's good tactics.

Eragon Zarroc · Jul 03, 2010, 04:45 PM // 16:45

well in pvp, you will alomost always see warriors and monks in balanced teams. warrior are frontline, monks are the backline healers. then you have everything else that is midline. but pvp and pve are two different worlds

there is much more variety in pve. go check out Kamadan and see if there is a better profession mix ;-)

Antelope Salad · Jul 03, 2010, 05:11 PM // 17:11

Oh cool. I didn't realize PvP was split into lines, that's pretty similar to Atlantica Online.

I'm glad to hear the other classes aren't useless. I'm taking a pretty strong liking to the Necro/Mes combo, hopefully they can be considered top tier in PvP as a mid liner.

mistokibbles · Jul 03, 2010, 05:43 PM // 17:43

Necro/Mes is used mainly in Hexway builds using the elite skill Lingering Curse and Auspicious Incantation or Ether Phantom + Drain Delusions for energy management. In balanced builds, necs are slightly back in the meta with the Barbed Signet change.

Rhamia Darigaz · Jul 03, 2010, 06:19 PM // 18:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Smith23

Using M/x or W/x allows the player not to really have to think when it comes to combat. You will also see a lot of D/x or A/x for that same reason.

Also W/x or M/x is a favorite when it comes to bot characters.

you literally just said midline requires more thinking than frontline or backline.

lol

*Darcy* · Jul 03, 2010, 06:47 PM // 18:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by Antelope Salad

If you go W/x then you can sub monk for a 55 build to quickly solo farm (I guess?), and in regular parties I'm sure there's a spot for a tank or someone who can make quick work of scattered trash mobs.

No one runs a warrior to use the secondary as a caster. Warriors do not have the energy pool for that. Warriors are popular for the high DPS they provide. And, as stated, they are a favorite "hang around town" character due to their great armors.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Antelope Salad

It seems like the GW devs made a huge effort to have a complex and dynamic game but the player base is almost all the same. Why is this?

As someone else said, you can't go by what you see in towns. I personally have nine characters covering every profession except Paragon and they get about the same amount of play time nowadays.

lishi · Jul 04, 2010, 12:12 AM // 00:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Antelope Salad

Oh cool. I didn't realize PvP was split into lines, that's pretty similar to Atlantica Online.

I'm glad to hear the other classes aren't useless. I'm taking a pretty strong liking to the Necro/Mes combo, hopefully they can be considered top tier in PvP as a mid liner.

That is a wrong attitude for pvp.

The best way to deal with pvp is making a pvp char, and change at will or as needed.

Jul 03, 2010, 03:23 PM // 15:23	#1
Antelope Salad Pre-Searing Cadet Join Date: Jul 2010	Completely new to GW, why is almost everyone W/x or M/x? I recently started to play GW and have been reading the various wiki sites for a while and just got to LA only to notice like 80% of the players are W/x or M/x. Then I started to observe PvP matches and the trend was the same. Usually 2-3 warriors, 3-4 monks and whatever else to fill in the gaps. Then I started to think about it and it kind of made sense but maybe I'm wrong because I don't know enough about the game. The way I see it is like... If you go M/x then you have the possibility of running any sub-class in PvE. This allows you to cater towards a lot of different situations, and you can also run a 55 variant of any sub-class for non-boss solo farming. Since healing/etc. seems to always be in demand you're set for finding parties and in the end you can unlock stuff no problem in PvE. In PvP you play the role of healer/buffer/wards/support/cleanser/etc. If you go W/x then you can sub monk for a 55 build to quickly solo farm (I guess?), and in regular parties I'm sure there's a spot for a tank or someone who can make quick work of scattered trash mobs. In PvP you're a primary damage dealer and in some cases crowd control. It seems like the GW devs made a huge effort to have a complex and dynamic game but the player base is almost all the same. Why is this? Is it due to the current PvE/PvP metagame or are the other main classes just outmatched compared to W and M? Since they are top tier in PvE and PvP then they seem like the only main character who can be made for PvE but also be used in PvP.

Jul 03, 2010, 04:05 PM // 16:05	#2
Chucky333 Academy Page Join Date: Aug 2008 Profession: Mo/	Warrior and Monk are staple characters in GW, that's just the way it is. Unless it's a gimmick build, both are very common in PvE and the in the current PvP meta melee professions other than warrior (Assassin and Dervish) hardly see any use in organized PvP. Some gimmick builds use non-monk backline like Rits or E\Rt, N\Rt etc. The rest of the characters are not just to fill the gap either. Midline is very important. I'm not entirely sure i understand the question. If you're asking whether just some professions are used extensively and others are hardly used, then the answer is yes. Both in PvE and PvP. Why? Balance issues and flawed design from Anet probably saw to that.

Jul 03, 2010, 04:06 PM // 16:06	#3
Smith23 Guest Join Date: May 2010 Profession: E/	Using M/x or W/x allows the player not to really have to think when it comes to combat. You will also see a lot of D/x or A/x for that same reason. Also W/x or M/x is a favorite when it comes to bot characters.

Jul 03, 2010, 04:32 PM // 16:32	#4
FoxBat Furnace Stoker Join Date: Apr 2006 Guild: Amazon Basin [AB] Profession: Mo/Me	As far as PvE goes, W and Mo are only overly popular with newbies due to percieved survivability, which is all you are going to find in the outposts that aren't traders/botters. Experienced players are usually off in their own instances; many of them may be playing W and Mo which are fine classes, but that is far from making them either the strongest or most versatile PvE characters. "Balanced" GW PvP is fundamentally about warriors vs monks with everyone else just for show, although that is less true these days with all the gimmicky caster DPS running amok in casual formats and GvG tiebreakers.

Jul 03, 2010, 04:38 PM // 16:38	#5
Fate Crusher Wilds Pathfinder Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Pie-land Guild: Warlords Of The Underworld [WoTU] Profession: Mo/	Firstly, I can safely say everyone you see is capable of rolling on to a different character and play a different profession. Players have main characters they like to concentrate on title/expensive armour pieces and weapons in order to show off. Warrior is a prime example because the armour types are very distinguished. For PvE, especially in Hard Mode, frontliners in parties are preferred to have high armour otherwise they're a waste. Critical Agility for Assassins increase their base armour to 90, but a warrior with shield has 96, plus absorption and physical reduction. Personally, i think a MS/DB (Moebius Strike/Death Blossom) assassin provides so much more as a frontliner because of huge damage and 33% quicker attack speed. Monks are preferred because of prots. Rits are great to utilise sometimes (combine Weapon of Fury with a Imbagon/warrior/sin), but just can't support a group as guaranteed as a monk. PvP will be more difficult to explain. Yes warriors are a primary source of damage. but blindly attacking everything without tactics isn't the key to success. Neither is the "a monk heals, so i attack that first" theory created by most 4v4 beginners. This is where the midline comes in. Example, for defensive reasons, Guild A choose to run a Blinding Surge Ele to counter the melee damage. However, Guild B has a pro ranger. He is firstly capable of disrupting said ele and allow the melee to be free of blind and possibly weakness (also sucks). Now, Guild B uses their hammer war to keep the bsurge ele in a KD chain and also pressure with damage he can't kite, which also means effective AoE can be implemented (this is just an example. this tactic is normally used in HA). this puts pressure on monks because as a 2 monk backline, they are always better at healing/protting each other or themselves. This is also the reason why interrupts or shutdowns (Mesmer or Ranger) are heavily preferred because they can be implemented defensively (said bsurge) or offensively, by shutting down/interrupting monks. It also makes sense in 4v4 to pressure targets other than the monk if they have bonnetti's, which upon a melee attack, they gain energy. if you ignore them and drain their energy out without allowing them to regenerate, that's good tactics.

Jul 03, 2010, 04:45 PM // 16:45	#6
Eragon Zarroc Atra estern?? ono thelduin Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Madness Incarnate Guild: [Duo] Profession: W/P	well in pvp, you will alomost always see warriors and monks in balanced teams. warrior are frontline, monks are the backline healers. then you have everything else that is midline. but pvp and pve are two different worlds there is much more variety in pve. go check out Kamadan and see if there is a better profession mix ;-)

Jul 03, 2010, 05:11 PM // 17:11	#7
Antelope Salad Pre-Searing Cadet Join Date: Jul 2010	Oh cool. I didn't realize PvP was split into lines, that's pretty similar to Atlantica Online. I'm glad to hear the other classes aren't useless. I'm taking a pretty strong liking to the Necro/Mes combo, hopefully they can be considered top tier in PvP as a mid liner.

Jul 03, 2010, 05:43 PM // 17:43	#8
mistokibbles Lion's Arch Merchant Join Date: Mar 2008 Profession: N/A	Necro/Mes is used mainly in Hexway builds using the elite skill Lingering Curse and Auspicious Incantation or Ether Phantom + Drain Delusions for energy management. In balanced builds, necs are slightly back in the meta with the Barbed Signet change.